Bad day with Ruckus

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ruckusluvr

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Yesterday Ruckus was horrible. Days like this really do scare me. We were walking out on the nature trail with Lynn, and my mother's husky Gunner. Well, when we were leaving the trail a man with a hood was walking on the same trail as us so I got over of course. Ruckus was lunging at him and growling, barking, and snarling. Ruckus was out of control. It was all I could to to hold his now 40lb (big sheltie) body on the leash. The leash even slipped some. Everything was so out of control and I felt helpless. He wouldnt sit, leave it, down... nothing! Keep in mind that Ruckus does obedience and he KNOWS what those words mean very very well. And then a group of teenagers passed up. I bet there was 7 of them. The same thing happened with them, but of course since there were more of them his episode lasted longer and it was becoming increasingly hard for me to hold the leash. And those teenagers were laughing at him and one said "I dare you to bite me you stupid dog, I will shoot you right between the eyes!" And they were even barking back at him. Ruckus in his rage turned around and bit me. He almost broke the skin!

This used to happen LOADS more. Ruckus has gotten sooooo much better and has not done anything like this in a long time. Today was a major set back. I am very upset. If he got a hold of them people it wouldnt be nips.... he was lunging up at them, he was out for blood. I am scared that one day its going to get so bad i will have to put him down. I think most people would say that it is to that point. but there is no way. I bought a head halter to walk him with so I can have better control.

It's not like I dont work with him, or train him. I do. We do obideance, agility, and we have even started in rally! He is a perfect boy unless we are in his nieghbor hood, his house, HIS natural trails! I have taken him to a behaviorist that helped us a whole lot. But we are regressing. (The behaviorists basically uses cesar milan's techniques)
 
I wish I had some advice for you, but I don't, but I am sure someone will. How old is he now? Chinook is not 'listening' to me as much either anymore. He is 8 months old and in the 'teenage' stage. I hope you figure out how to curb this behaviour before it does get someone hurt, like you said.
 
I'm so sorry for this setback. Think safety first for you and your dog...harness and maybe a muzzle? Or maybe avoid the "my territory" areas for a bit?

I just don't have experience with training out aggression. I worked with Indy as a pup on dominance issues; because Indy was purchased, in part, as the final stage in helping my son get over a severe fear of dogs. Indy was not an aggressive dog at any point, but I didn't want any setbacks for my son so I did a lot of work with Indy where I would put him on his side or back beside me and keep a hand on him while not looking at him until he relaxed. After he relaxed a while I would praise him. Indy liked to jump up on me, so I would also tell him "off" and then stand straddling him...again not looking at him (no challenge...no discussion, I AM ALPHA). I did work with Emma as a puppy as she is a very alpha female...no amount of work will get her to go to her side or back unless SHE wants to. But I did cut back on her habit of "clapping" her jaws at people. I have to confess that I have not worked enough with Figaro, who has a bad habit of jumping up and pushing me in the butt! I have stopped his jumping when he is in front of me but the silly twit just waits until I walk past and then tags my fanny. ARGH Sasha's behavior training has primarily been to reduce her fear peeing and her fear of men and metal food bowls. She's doing great.

I know this is hard for you, particularly since you have been going the extra mile to train your boy.
 
It sounds like fear aggression to me. A hooded man may be unusual to Ruckus, and a mob of jeering barking morons can strike fear even in an adult human.

Can I suggest some reading material? I picked up The Cautious Canine and Control Unleashed. They are great and give very useful tips on how to control a reactive dog using positive training. I'm not a big fan of Cesar Milan because I think some of his methods overwhelm the dog (stresses the dog to the point where they shut down) or have the potential to create situations where the aggression is redirected or create misdirected associations for the dog. That's just my view. But as always, whatever you're comfortable with and works, is best!

Retrain him with the techniques you're comfy with, with hooded people and groups of noisy people. The ones taught in the books emphasize keeping the dog under their stress threshold (the point where they start becoming reactive) when it meets anything it's reactive towards. They say this is how to correct behaviour. If the dog goes beyond the threshold, it's learning little if anything at all. Over time, you work to raise the threshold level so the dog can take more and more stress while remaining unreactive.

It may just be an unlucky day that you bumped into the 2 types of people that Ruckus is unfamiliar with. Don't give up and certainly don't consider putting Ruckus to sleep! With the correct methods this sort of aggression can be helped. I know how it feels to have a bad day or caught off guard (Romeo's had his fair share, and I panic and and start ranting on the forum!) but then the next day, Romeo does alot better (and I stop worrying so much). There will be more of such days (unfortunately! Dogs like humans make mistakes), so all we can do is persevere with the training, be prepared and take each day as it comes. I say this, but I still panic every time! :lol:
 
How scary for you! That must be very disappointing too. I have no idea what to do, so I am no help there, but I am sure the answer is out there. I am so sorry that you are having this big setback. I went through many of them over the 28 years I have had a Sheltie in my life, so I understand how frustrating it can be. Be sure to let us know how things turn out for you and your boy.
 
A good book for lead aggression related issues is Patricia McConnells Feisty Fido. I did have it but lent it to someone, I bought it for my dog aggressive malamute we had and it teaches some re-direction methods, may be of some help :)
 
I don't have alot of advice for you yet, I'm afraid. Just alot of love and support. I know you are trying to do all the right things, but something is definitely out of kilter.

Can you perhaps remind us of Ruckus' history? How old is he, how long have you had him? Where did you get him? Shelties are not normally aggressive - assertive yes. But a 40lb Sheltie is also on the big size. Is there possibly a mix in there?

Perhaps you may need to limit the public walks for awhile. Or perhaps limit the walk to just yourself and Ruckus (and leave Gunner behind). Perhaps he's feeling protective? You could also try conditioning in the safety of your backyard (if you have one) where it's less threatening. Bring the pup to your yard and introduce "strangers", treating and praising.

Good luck!
 
Thanks for the help guys.
Ruckus is a 2 and 1/2 yr old sheltie. He came from a show kennel. Both of his parents are champions, so no, he is not a mix. he is a tall timber throwback. I got him at 4 months old and actually took the time to properly socialize this guy, and he has always been fearful of people.

Its very upsetting. I socialized as a puppy! Puppy preschool! Obideance, rally, agility, weekly dog park visits (he is an angel at the dog park BTW) play dates left and right! and he still ends up like this.
 
A previous poster mentioned Control Unleashed, it is a very good book for working through reactivity problems. The author also runs a Yahoo group where she personally answers reader's questions, which is a great resource.

Wish I had more advice for you, I hope that you are able to work through the issues and be happy on nature walks with Ruckus!
 
I've got Control Unleashed on order, as an agility instructor has recommended it to me. Snap is still an adolescent, however, he exhibits some of the same out of control behavior as Ruckus when we are out in public. I'm drilling "look" and "leave it" at the moment and rewarding for it; and will start with a private trainer this week to work with handling distractions in public.
 
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