If buy a 2 year old sheltie, Issues, No attachment ?

I definitely have no show experience, but hope to in the next few years... but from the breeders I've met, there seems to be a wide variety of ideas. As well as good versus bad show breeders. Personally, I would never show if my dogs couldn't be part of the family. We have outdoor exercise pens for playing and running off steam, but all of our dogs live inside with us. "Us" includes me, my husband, 7 preteen or teenage children... Along with daily visits from our adult kids and many little grandchildren. So our dogs are definitely socialized. If that doesn't work with training show puppies...I'll just not show... Lol
 
Wow, you have your hands full! I too believe in keeping my show dogs as pets which is why I refused to sell show prospects and stud services to most people in the fancy. Most of the belgian friends I have do performance stuff with their dogs. Dogs are pretty smart. They learn quickly which lead they have on and what that means. With the terriers I found that doing obedience first shaved off just a little too much of the sparkle that they HAVE to have to be competitive but our herding dogs got away with it quite nicely, and actually I think it was good to do some obedience type work before showing them as they are more likely to come undone in the ring if something strange is happening. Herders are bred to notice things that are "different" so that they require more work that the average terrier to prep for the world of showing. That's why I am stunned to hear that some sheltie breeders are not socializing prospects. Makes me wonder how invested they are about other things.
 
From everything I've read here, "socialize" seems to mean different things to different people. I have the impression that some believe that if the dog has not lived in a house and been regarded as a pet, it has not been socialized. My experience is different--as mentioned, my dogs were kenneled, and most definitely not pets, but they were well-loved and well-treated. They can go into any "formal" setting and be calm and perfect. But when they first arrived, they were less good with the unfamiliar--for instance, a jogger running up behind us during a walk made one practically hurl herself to the ground (making the poor runner think she'd killed the dog). It was not something she had ever experienced, and it scared her. But just once. I would call them socialized, but they needed additional time to adapt to a new way of living, and different types of socialization.
 
PatC said:
From everything I've read here, "socialize" seems to mean different things to different people. I have the impression that some believe that if the dog has not lived in a house and been regarded as a pet, it has not been socialized. My experience is different--as mentioned, my dogs were kenneled, and most definitely not pets, but they were well-loved and well-treated. They can go into any "formal" setting and be calm and perfect. But when they first arrived, they were less good with the unfamiliar--for instance, a jogger running up behind us during a walk made one practically hurl herself to the ground (making the poor runner think she'd killed the dog). It was not something she had ever experienced, and it scared her. But just once. I would call them socialized, but they needed additional time to adapt to a new way of living, and different types of socialization.
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There are definitely good breeders that kennel their dogs. Their dogs get attention and are very much loved. I didn't mean to suggest that all kennel experiences are bad. A good breeder gives their dogs the attention they need, and I'm sure your dogs are well taken care of. I just know that my family situation wouldn't afford me the time to do a good job if I couldn't just incorporate my fur babies into our household for training. So personally, at this point in my life, this is what works for us. I hope I didn't suggest that all kennel kept dogs are neglected, because that's certainly not the case. There are bad breeders in every situation.
 
I bought a grown out show dog and he is the biggest suck dog ever. I do know that he spent a big part of his early life in a kennel and this might be why he is so sucky now.

Notwithstanding, I'm assuming that you have the opportunity to visit with the pup? That's the ultimate deciding factor. Meet the pup then you decide how socialized he/she is.
 
Tagg said:
Wow, you have your hands full! I too believe in keeping my show dogs as pets which is why I refused to sell show prospects and stud services to most people in the fancy. Most of the belgian friends I have do performance stuff with their dogs. Dogs are pretty smart. They learn quickly which lead they have on and what that means. With the terriers I found that doing obedience first shaved off just a little too much of the sparkle that they HAVE to have to be competitive but our herding dogs got away with it quite nicely, and actually I think it was good to do some obedience type work before showing them as they are more likely to come undone in the ring if something strange is happening. Herders are bred to notice things that are "different" so that they require more work that the average terrier to prep for the world of showing. That's why I am stunned to hear that some sheltie breeders are not socializing prospects. Makes me wonder how invested they are about other things.
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well said!!
Very true a dog is smart to know what lead is for what event!

I have had friends experience a side of un socialized show dogs... There are plenty of dogs that won't do basic obedience and are shut down when confronted with new stuff. All they have been allowed to do is stand and look pretty. Can not get the concept of offering behaviours. From kennel to kennel, to show ring to kennel. Stand still if a judge touches you... MOST definitely not enough socialization and experience for a companion dog for most households.
That's why it is so important to speak with the breeder and get a sense what work they do with the puppies.
 
When I started looking for my second Sheltie (which ended up being puppy mill rescue Bela), I made many encouraging contacts both locally and regionally. I really wanted a retired show dog that I could train and show in obedience. My second choice was a "grown out" breeder's dog. Well, neither of those worked out, but I met some fantastic people who keep me in mind when they have any dogs available.

It takes a lot of time and cultivation of relationships (both in person and on Facebook or Sheltie Nation) to find just the right breeder who will lead you to just the right dog! I know many breeders now who would gladly place a dog with me because they know me, they know my methods, and they know any dog placed with me would be a cherished part of my family.

I'm still in the market for my obedience competitor, but coming across Bela and dealing with her unique problems has made me a much better trainer and "puppy raiser" and problem solver in preparation for that once-in-a-lifetime working dog.
 
Well cared for and well socialized are not always one in the same. The example you gave, PatC, is not what I would consider well socialized. I don't think kennel dogs are generally socialized to the same level that a pet or performance dog would be.
I have had friends experience a side of un socialized show dogs... There are plenty of dogs that won't do basic obedience and are shut down when confronted with new stuff. All they have been allowed to do is stand and look pretty. Can not get the concept of offering behaviours. From kennel to kennel, to show ring to kennel. Stand still if a judge touches you... MOST definitely not enough socialization and experience for a companion dog for most households.
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I experienced that first hand, and won't make the same mistake again.
 
HopeShelties said:
Well cared for and well socialized are not always one in the same. The example you gave, PatC, is not what I would consider well socialized. I don't think kennel dogs are generally socialized to the same level that a pet or performance dog would be.

I experienced that first hand, and won't make the same mistake again.
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To each his own. :smile2: while my dogs had to make adjustments to pet life after kennel life, they had been sufficiently socialized to allow them to make that transition quickly. I think it was more about adapting to their new way of life, and new situations, rather than lack of socialization. They are amazing in intelligence and temperament and just allover well-behaved sweetness, I will always be grateful to the breeder who raised them.
 
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