The boys are going herding

[ClantyreSheltie]

I have heard that it screws up agility dogs. Any truth to that?

Quite the opposite, I think. Herding is a job the dog does that requires independent thought and instinct to know what to do. The human gives direction and the dog is supposed to figure out how to implement that direction. Agility is a game of control, where we teach the dogs to 100% focus on the person (tug, tug, cookies, more cookie, more tug). They don't develop the same problem solving skills as true herding dogs. With few exceptions, you can tell agility dogs from herding dogs. Agility dogs are always looking back at the human for direction, and sometimes won't go away from the human. They require much more micro-managing than herding/working dogs.

So no, you can wreck a good herding dog with agility/obedience, but I don't think you can wreck an agility dog in herding, unless he gets run over or injured by the livestock.

The exception is whats-her-name in my area (escapes me now) who has three rescue smooth coated BC's, who regularly go HIT in herding and are multi-MACH dogs.

 

[Calliesmom]

Hahaha. I like that. Okay, I'm going to try. I have heard that it screws up agility dogs. Any truth to that?

The local (and by that I mean within 50 miles) sheep herding thing is only on thursday's, so I'll have to take a day off. But I am always going to wonder otherwise. Now, I just need to find a "dry" time to do this during.

if your dog does well in herding, you'll end up with awesome distance skills in agility

 

[nbrard]

Hahaha.

Now, I just need to find a "dry" time to do this during.

A real sheep herder wouldn't wait until it was dry!

 

[Justicemom]

Hahaha. I like that. Okay, I'm going to try. I have heard that it screws up agility dogs. Any truth to that?

The local (and by that I mean within 50 miles) sheep herding thing is only on thursday's, so I'll have to take a day off. But I am always going to wonder otherwise. Now, I just need to find a "dry" time to do this during.

I routinely screw up my dogs by asking them to do different things-Obedience ,rally, agilty, herding, conformation and even alittle weight pulling and tracking. So don't ask me

No seriously, I have been told that in every venue I have showed in that I will ruin it if I do x,y,z other sport. Has yet to happen. It is all in the training. SUre at the beginning there might be alittle confusion until they know their job but once they know what to do and the commands , no issues.

I don't worry about teaching me breed dog to sit because I also teach them to stand. Justice never once sat in the breed ring though ever one said he would. One day in Canada got BOS over 5 specials(that boy was a showman) and HIT out of Open in obedience in the same hour. I never even move the dang show collar out of place.

I don't think our dogs are that dumb. Nice thing about shelties, great multitaskers.

 

[corbinam]

No seriously, I have been told that in every venue I have showed in that I will ruin it if I do x,y,z other sport. Has yet to happen. It is all in the training. SUre at the beginning there might be alittle confusion until they know their job but once they know what to do and the commands , no issues.

I think that's definitely true. Think back to when you taught your dog to down. I know at least for my dogs when they were first learning, they confused sit and down. I'd ask for one and get the other.

Is that a reason to not teach the dog to lay down? No, you just have to be clear as to what you want.

 

[k9kreationz]

Thanks everyone!! I know of a few people who did a little herding and it totally messed up their agility game (but their dogs were already independent). This could help Koji if he's good at it, with more independence on the course.

Also, unless I own a farm, no herding in wet/damp conditions. I'm already "ew'ing" about the poop that is going to be all over my dog. LOL.

Lastly, Ashley, I admit. Koji still downs when I say sit and vice versa. I use hand signals also, which usually helps him figure out which I want. I never did really fix it. honestly, never really cared. LOL.

 

[Sharon7]

Ooooo I really need to look into this for the girls. I think Asta has a very strong herding instinct. Need to find out if there's anything around these parts. I think it would be such a hoot.

Loved the video of Grizz and Jaime. It just looks like such fun!

 

[corbinam]

Lastly, Ashley, I admit. Koji still downs when I say sit and vice versa. I use hand signals also, which usually helps him figure out which I want. I never did really fix it. honestly, never really cared. LOL.

(So does Lexi...she sits, and then if I don't reward fast enough--read: within 2 seconds--she lays down)

 

[Ember90710]

This sounds like so much fun! I would love to see what my dog would do with herding...I think she would love it!

 

[SheltieChe]

I think that's definitely true. Think back to when you taught your dog to down. I know at least for my dogs when they were first learning, they confused sit and down. I'd ask for one and get the other.

Is that a reason to not teach the dog to lay down? No, you just have to be clear as to what you want.

it depends how you teach your dog. Luring will get you mucho confusion. Think of it in those terms- you got a ride to certain place and you think you know how you got there but next time you have to drive yourself ... you will get lost if not for GPS Passive memory at the best, does not create understanding.
Now with shaping when your dog has to think and then lightbulb goes off "got it" you will get that down every time. Then you proof that down at your home, at your yard, at dog park, at a trial and "down" will always mean down... Just matter of efficiency learning.
as for agility and herding... herding represents a great amount of self reinforcement to the dog, much more than agility IMHO because it is instinctual behavior. I've noticed that initially I am not even in the picture, it is much fun just to chase sheep. Then comes the part when lightbulb goes off "oh mommy you are here too".... then " oh boy, it was so much fun but now we are suppose to have rules?"
Now we are about 6 lessons into herding, for the first time I've trusted myself to trust my dogs to know what they are doing and I think it was biggest obstacle I was facing. Sure enough, they knew it all along. Today they did what I asked. Actually much similar with the way we do agility- my body motion told my dogs what I wanted. I do not see how it will screw up our agility.