Article on De-barking

[Caro]

someone that poisons a poor innocent dog needs to be beaten and jailed for the rest of his/her life !!!!

And it wasnt even my dog that was doing the barking - but the police dont see our pets the same way, so nothing happened! There have been a spate of dog poisonings where I live over the last year so it makes me very worried.

 

[danisgoat]

Someone I know had acid dumped on their dog....because the man was so angry with the dog barking.

Someone in the town next to us shot their dog in front of the dog's kids.

Seriously.....if you do not have crazy neighbors, consider yourself Blessed. If you do have neighbors that complain and you take them seriously. Debarking may be the most human thing you can do for you dog....considering the alternatives.

 

[SheltieGuy]

Someone I know had acid dumped on their dog....because the man was so angry with the dog barking.

Someone in the town next to us shot their dog in front of the dog's kids.

Seriously.....if you do not have crazy neighbors, consider yourself Blessed. If you do have neighbors that complain and you take them seriously. Debarking may be the most human thing you can do for you dog....considering the alternatives.

it is unreal that people could be soo cruel to animals...!! and it is such a common occurrence. Animal planet ( i think thats the channel) has shows on constantly and I am amazed and saddened how animals get neglected and abused. IF you have a dog ... and for some reason change your mind and dont want him anymore... dont chain him to a tree and forget about him.. at least take him to a shelter. have some compassion!!! that **** really pisses me off!!!!... i believe an eye for an eye ... if you tie a heavy chain around your dogs neck and have him bake in the sun till he dies ... well then you deserve the same punishment !!!!!



another show called HOARDERS .. a lady had 114 + cats in her home ... 30 or so were dead and rotting under mounds of trash unknown to the owner. Granted the lady was not in the right frame of mind but still the poor cats had to suffer for it.

 

[romeosangiovese]

I really do love how civilised this forum is. I know others would have ended up in all kinds of insults and personal remarks!!

I used to have a pretty rigid view about debarking until I met you guys and got to hear of stories of horrible neighbours. Then I realised in certain circumstances it's far better to do the surgery than to let your dog suffer/die/be taken away.

Most here live in flats. Houses are usually right next to each other too. Most live within spitting distance of another, so sound is always a problem. Strangely, the occurrence of debarking is not high. I haven't figured out why tho'. Those who have debarked here tend to be breeders with more than the allowed number of dogs in their flat (max 1) or apartment/house (max 3). This could be their way of ensuring the authorities don't come knocking on their door on their licences.

Romeo's a barker and I heard Juliet is the progeny of barkers (sigh!) so I might have a barking orchestra on my hands! We're looking to rent a house in a dog friendly neighbourhood so the risk of complaints is lower. Of course I will also leave my coins in a can out just in case!

 

[The Quahog]

I believe it should be outlawed.. do you want someone else to make the decision to cut your vocal chords or your childs?
part of the article:
Critics of the debarking procedure say it is outdated and inhumane, one that destroys an animal’s central means of communication merely for the owner’s convenience. Many veterinarians refuse to do the surgery on ethical grounds.

I agree 100%!!

When i first got here I happened to step into this particular hornet's nest myself, albeit somewhat more circumspectly.
From a personal basis,I suppose I should add as full disclosure that i have never debarked a dog, will not, and would not recommend it.

However, animal issues are often complex, far beyond the ' If you truly love animals the answer is obvious' approach. I have often said that there are two kinds of people who do not make good animal control officers- people who don't love animals and people who do. Work with the ACOs for awhile and you will see what I mean -you have to keep your composure in situations that would just make an animal lover berserk. If i were an ACO I would be in prison for strangling people. As I said, animals and our relationships to them are a very complicated subject.

Whether its zoos, debarking, or PETA there are rarely simple, cut and dried answers of 'right and wrong'. (OK , for PETA wrong is generally a pretty safe bet, but they are generally well intentioned and do serve a positive purpose on some issues.)

Point being, as admirable as your passion is, if very good people are in opposition of your viewpoint on an issue, no matter how much of a 'no-brainer' it is to you intuitively, it's probably a good idea to test the waters with your toe before you leap in. - Dr. Mac

 

[Silaria]

A lot of the heated discussion around whether debarking is a good practice or not comes from looking at a situation from a "black and white" point of view and not being open to the "gray" areas that tend to cloud every situation. There are very few times when things really are "black and white".

Surgery, ANY surgery - including spay and neutering, should be approached with knowledge and understanding of what and why. In the cases of spay/neuter, the situation is closer to "black and white" than debarking is since spay/neuter can reduce the chances of a dog catching certain diseases like cancers and helps control pet over population; the impact is much more obvious. However, there are people who won't do a spay/neuter because they think it is cruel. (Sound familiar?)

We owned a Finnish Spitz, a dog even MORE known for their barking than a Sheltie. Their nickname in 'the barking bird dog of Finland' and our Melody's sire won awards for his barking. She wasn't debarked and we did have the police called on us for her constant barking; thankfully only once because we were able to adjust where she was in the house when we weren't home to not bother the neighbors. After having a Finkie, a Sheltie bark wasn't a big deal.

When we first went to visit Edan at this breeder, we were a bit taken aback by the fact that the dogs were debarked. His breeder didn't hide the fact or why she did it. The dogs were also happy, healthy, well loved, and cared for; which was MUCH more important than the debarking. We are already planning to get another dog from our breeder when another litter is available; it's already been discussed with the breeder because the temperament and health of her dogs is FANTASTIC.

If I didn't have first hand experience with a debarked dog, my opinion on the issue may be different but experience is a wonderful teacher. Would I run out and automatically do it? No, I don't like the idea of surgery for surgeries sake. Would I consider it if it came down to the surgery or giving up my dog? Darn straight I would! I LOVE my dog, or dogs when we have multiple. Like so many here, they are my children and I will do whatever it takes to keep them with me.

 

[The Quahog]

So how do people feel about the topic of 'disarming' - that is pulling a dog's teeth if he is a biter and training is unable to correct the viciousness?

Do folks here see any correlation from the 'If the choice is 'disarm' him or euthanize', or 'It would be better just to to train him properly....' arguments?

Not an easy issue. - Dr. Mac

 

[SheltieGuy]

MOst of my opinion with debarking comes from personal experience.. The only problem I have had about barking dogs is when a neighbor has an "outside"dog" tied to a tree with an old falling apart dog house ... who only gets attention when the owner gets off his lazy A S S to feed her. AND of course the poor dog is going to bark ... i blame the owner not the poor dog .
And first of all in my opinion if you are going to buy a dog .. it belongs in the house with you for love shelter and companionship not to be left alone to rot outside. When I was younger I saw this with many neighbors.. Now if I saw this i would be on the phone with Animal Control in a second.. in fact I called 2 weeks ago with a potential mistreated dog. Now keep in mind I live in PA and it is normal for it to be -20 on any given winter nite.... for those people that have outside dogs in warm climates... welll i still dont get the reasoning behind wanting a dog but it at least it wont freeze to death but then again it may get too hot for a dog .

AS for Dr. Mac's question about disarming. That is another can of worms that i dont want to open just yet ..lol....


If the choice is 'disarm' him or euthanize' umm i would have to find a third option because I dont like the first two.

 

[Chris]

I am with you Ania.. He IS my SON. He has fur and four legs... but still my son... i have no wife or children.. no parents or grandparents.. I have one twin brother (not identical) and my furson Snickers. I lost my job and I literally eat cheap food (hotdogs..soup... on sale stuff) so I can get my boy better food. (so some may think i am crazy ,,, but when I think about how my last dog suffered and died in my arms ...it seems like the right thing for me to do .) For the lucky people with real children: I am sure you would go without something for them ... well that is how i feel.

FROMM (they have great food and a great heart as well) gave me a bunch of coupons to help me and my SON out. I sent them a long letter of appreciation.Maybe FROMM isnt the best food but they went out of their way to help me and I am grateful for that.

And yes I understand that a situation may arise that you have to move due to money issues or for a job ... and well to be honest I hope none of us have to consider debarking as part of the issue.(if it happened to me I dont know what I would do to be honest). Of course I wouldnt give him up .

So yes I understand that in some instances i guess you do what you gotta do . But for me personally it would break my heart to do that to my boy.

If you are in favor of debarking .... we can agree to disagree... I am not here to judge or be judged. Debate and discussion is how we all learn.

You have a warm and generous heart, SheltieGuy, and I support and respect your relationship with your boy. Snickers couldn't have a better Dad!

 

[take4roll10]

So how do people feel about the topic of 'disarming' - that is pulling a dog's teeth if he is a biter and training is unable to correct the viciousness?

Do folks here see any correlation from the 'If the choice is 'disarm' him or euthanize', or 'It would be better just to to train him properly....' arguments?

Not an easy issue. - Dr. Mac

I personally don't think debarking can be compared to this. A bark will not harm a person. A dog, who is a biter can be a danger to other animals and people.
My parent's chihuahua will bite people she doesn't know. We just don't take her anywhere and if people come over, she is crated. However, the circumstance is different when you have a bigger dog.
I hope that I would never have to make that decision. I know I would never pull their teeth. It is painful for the dog and he will never be the same. My parent's maltese had 11 teeth pulled because they were decaying. I think she has changed since the procedure. She seems depressed now.