White factored

[MissSuzie]

Hi Strider,

The merle gene and the white-factor gene are two very different things. Deja definitely has the merle gene (that's easy to figure out!), and shouldn't be bred to a merle dog. It can be tricker to figure out if a dog is white-factored, but it's safe to say that, if the dog has white going up the stifle and/or white all the way up the foreleg and into the ruff, s/he's white-factored. Sometimes a dog that doesn't have this pattern will produce a CHW - and then you have to assume that both parents were white-factored.

As has been pointed out, there's absolutely nothing wrong with CHWs. They're just as healthy as their siblings. However, if you're trying to produce dogs that will be competitive in the AKC conformation ring, why not avoid CHWs in your litter? (This is why it's generally best to avoid producing sable merles - you risk ending up with a beautiful puppy that isn't showable because of the blue eyes.) It's interesting to note that CHWs are accepted by the Collie AKC Standard.

I had to look up "stifle" to see what you were talking about. Would you say that Meggie is "white factored." I'm confused about this.

 

[Strider]

Hi Strider,

The merle gene and the white-factor gene are two very different things. Deja definitely has the merle gene (that's easy to figure out!), and shouldn't be bred to a merle dog. It can be tricker to figure out if a dog is white-factored, but it's safe to say that, if the dog has white going up the stifle and/or white all the way up the foreleg and into the ruff, s/he's white-factored. Sometimes a dog that doesn't have this pattern will produce a CHW - and then you have to assume that both parents were white-factored.

As has been pointed out, there's absolutely nothing wrong with CHWs. They're just as healthy as their siblings. However, if you're trying to produce dogs that will be competitive in the AKC conformation ring, why not avoid CHWs in your litter? (This is why it's generally best to avoid producing sable merles - you risk ending up with a beautiful puppy that isn't showable because of the blue eyes.) It's interesting to note that CHWs are accepted by the Collie AKC Standard.

Deja would definately be white factored then. Her front forlegs are solid white on the front. She has a tan line right at her knee but it is only on the sides of her leg.

 

[Strider]

I had to look up "stifle" to see what you were talking about. Would you say that Meggie is "white factored." I'm confused about this.

deja looks about the same as far as white on the legs goes. Her left leg has the same kind of wrap. Her right leg is solid white though.

 

[tofu pup]

I had to look up "stifle" to see what you were talking about. Would you say that Meggie is "white factored." I'm confused about this.

She could be - you'd need a photo of her from the side, too, though.

Here's a link:
http://www.norcalshelties.org/SheltieColors/whitemarkings.html

If you scroll down to the section "white-factoring", there's a picture of a bi-black who appears to be white-factored. The arrow points to the stifle, where there's a big band of white. The front legs tell you some, but the hind legs tell you more.

 

[Justicemom]

I have some examples of white factored vs non white factored dogs.

Diva is white factored. You can see the white going up the back leg and the white connecting to the ruff like Tofupup said.

Justice is non white factored. You can see the white stops on the lower leg and the white front legs are seperated from the ruff by brown

Pike is white factored and a sable merle. It is very hard to tell that he is a sable merle and he does not have blue eyes. Pike is AKC pointed.

 

[tofu pup]

Justicemom, these are perfect! I was just looking around at our dogs and trying to figure out how I would get photos of them on the forum ASAP... your pups illustrate the concept beautifully!

 

[Lightplum]

yes your pics show wonderfully the factoring...also Pike is beautiful!!

 

[MissSuzie]

I have some examples of white factored vs non white factored dogs.

Diva is white factored. You can see the white going up the back leg and the white connecting to the ruff like Tofupup said.

Justice is non white factored. You can see the white stops on the lower leg and the white front legs are seperated from the ruff by brown

Pike is white factored and a sable merle. It is very hard to tell that he is a sable merle and he does not have blue eyes. Pike is AKC pointed.

Thank you ladies. I understand now. Meggie is not white-factored. She has white paws in the back but her legs are tan. These pictures are great examples. Thank you so much!

BTW, Pike is beautiful!!!

 

[Narmowen]

Thank you ladies. I understand now. Meggie is not white-factored. She has white paws in the back but her legs are tan. These pictures are great examples. Thank you so much!

BTW, Pike is beautiful!!!

From what I've read, she could still be white-factored. Just because her legs are tan, doesn't mean that she isn't white factored. Alternatively, just because Luke (my boy) has white stifles, and is a very flashy dog doesn't mean that he's white factored.

 

[MissSuzie]

From what I've read, she could still be white-factored. Just because her legs are tan, doesn't mean that she isn't white factored. Alternatively, just because Luke (my boy) has white stifles, and is a very flashy dog doesn't mean that he's white factored.

Well then how are we supposed to know? I guess it doesn't matter for me because Meggie is spayed and not being bred. I was just curious.