Calliesmom
Moderator
yes- but that dog was on leash but got loose...................
and then attacked my leashed dog...........
The Yellow Dog Project
- Thread starter BarbV
- Start date
yes- but that dog was on leash but got loose...................
and then attacked my leashed dog...........
JS
wherever I find myself, I have the responsibility to take the necessary step to protect my companion whatever the circumstances.
You are quite right in your assertion, and I have when I have felt threatened pushed another dog off of Beau and myself, only to have the owner come at me with a baseball bat. When the police arrived they basically, all but laughed in my face and told me it was my fault. Yep, you herd it, a dog off leash running up to bite my dog is my fault. The owners justification was" he's doing what all dogs do" The incident is now under an Internal Police investigation because the detectives who came to my house told me the officers did not do their jobs that day.
I would also like to add, when I was younger I lived in upstate NY. My foster parents had 52 acres of land. We had three dogs, who we use to just let roam the property. As a child, I didn't see any problem with that, they use to just stay in the yard, however, Meeka, our pure bred Beagle would roam and bring strange animals home and"display"them at the dinner table. Now, as an adult, even if I lived in the boon docks I seriously, seriously, doubt I would I would let Beau roam like that. Too many variables, aside from being shot from hunters, they would be easy prey for other animals like bears, foxes, a whole myriad of plants that could harm our babes and we wouldn't know how to help them once they came home(if they came home)because we didn't see what they got a hold of.
wherever I find myself, I have the responsibility to take the necessary step to protect my companion whatever the circumstances.
You are quite right in your assertion, and I have when I have felt threatened pushed another dog off of Beau and myself, only to have the owner come at me with a baseball bat. When the police arrived they basically, all but laughed in my face and told me it was my fault. Yep, you herd it, a dog off leash running up to bite my dog is my fault. The owners justification was" he's doing what all dogs do" The incident is now under an Internal Police investigation because the detectives who came to my house told me the officers did not do their jobs that day.
I would also like to add, when I was younger I lived in upstate NY. My foster parents had 52 acres of land. We had three dogs, who we use to just let roam the property. As a child, I didn't see any problem with that, they use to just stay in the yard, however, Meeka, our pure bred Beagle would roam and bring strange animals home and"display"them at the dinner table. Now, as an adult, even if I lived in the boon docks I seriously, seriously, doubt I would I would let Beau roam like that. Too many variables, aside from being shot from hunters, they would be easy prey for other animals like bears, foxes, a whole myriad of plants that could harm our babes and we wouldn't know how to help them once they came home(if they came home)because we didn't see what they got a hold of.
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dblock:
I would agree that this is an absurd reaction on not only the part of the owner of the other dog, but also the police department. I got a bit of a chuckle with your comment thinking about another dog owner coming at me with a baseball bat. It wasn't so much funny because the individual would go to such lengths, but because of my own beliefs about my personal protection, the other owner would have quickly found that he was seriously under armed
. (But that last comment was truly off topic). Getting back on topic, even though the other owner was waaay out of line with his reaction, it would seem that you and I do agree that the situation doesn't change our responsibility to our pet.At least we can hold out hope that the ship can be righted. The best that you can hope for is the internal investigation will force the officers to actually do their jobs moving forward.
I have one last thing to say about this and then I will shut up.:
:sadsmile:
I don't know about statutes in any other states but in Pa if you have a service animal who is attacked by another dog(regardless of whether the dog is on a leash or off of leash) you can be prosecuted by the District attorney's office because you are violating the persons rights under the ADA.
The line of reasoning for this special prosecution is that service animals are taught not to react negatively to other peoples animals. In addition, it prevents the animal from protecting its owner and doing their job.
Just thought some of you(not meant to be snarly)might be interested in knowing this
:sadsmile:I don't know about statutes in any other states but in Pa if you have a service animal who is attacked by another dog(regardless of whether the dog is on a leash or off of leash) you can be prosecuted by the District attorney's office because you are violating the persons rights under the ADA.
The line of reasoning for this special prosecution is that service animals are taught not to react negatively to other peoples animals. In addition, it prevents the animal from protecting its owner and doing their job.
Just thought some of you(not meant to be snarly)might be interested in knowing this
Not to mention that people who disagree with you are not necessarily idiots or morons, and calling them that is unlikely to help them see it from your point of view.
I would think that anyone who is on this forum is here because they love their sheltie(s)and want to share that likeminded folk. There's no way we're all going to agree about every topic but we can be respectful of others who see things differently and we can try to look for the common ground.
Not sure if I have understood properly but those of you who live in areas where there are leash laws seem to be saying that you still have incidents with dogs off leash?
If this is the case, then it would appear the leash restrictions are not working presumably because enforcement is insufficient?
I'm interested in this because in the UK there are frequent discussions on 'dog control' and obviously much debate about what will/will not work. With any kind of prohibition, it is only going to be as strong as the enforcement and these days dog issues are low priority and unlikely to get much funding.
I would also be very interested to know if there is a significant reduction in incidents of dog on dog aggression in areas with leash laws?
I think owners also have to take into account the type of dog they have if considering letting it off lead. Eg Hounds are likely to disappear after a scent if not very well trained, large guarding/working dogs can be intimidating to people and terriers can be a real risk to horseriders. I think the majority of shelties are likely to be on the receiving rather than dispensing end of trouble which is why we all feel so strongly about this subject. Discussing this with some large dog owners a year or so ago was very insightful as they often simply didn't realise how intimidating even a friendly approach can be to someone with a small frightened dog. It is very easy for small dogs, especially toy breeds to be injured even if the large dog is benignly trying to play but this aspect was overlooked. I was astonished that we small dog owners are regarded as being over-protective or neurotic and that it is our fault for having poorly socialised dogs if they cannot cope with a dog more than twice their size running directly at them!! It is NOT normal behaviour for dogs to approach others like this so no wonder our small dogs feel intimidated!
Wild canines never rush headlong into a strange animal's space and I wonder if part of the problem is that many dogs don't learn social manners when they are puppies. If they are taken early from the litter and not given the opputunity interact in a CONTROLLED situation while growing up then they don't realise what is unacceptable. Being on a lead does also make a lot of dogs feel trapped and act defensively which possibly provokes more of a reaction from off lead dogs.
Perhaps the answer is better education for owners (vet surgeries, pet shops, training clubs etc) as well as dogs. I think all new owners should attend compulsory training classes that cover behaviour as well as basic commands.
If this is the case, then it would appear the leash restrictions are not working presumably because enforcement is insufficient?
I'm interested in this because in the UK there are frequent discussions on 'dog control' and obviously much debate about what will/will not work. With any kind of prohibition, it is only going to be as strong as the enforcement and these days dog issues are low priority and unlikely to get much funding.
I would also be very interested to know if there is a significant reduction in incidents of dog on dog aggression in areas with leash laws?
I think owners also have to take into account the type of dog they have if considering letting it off lead. Eg Hounds are likely to disappear after a scent if not very well trained, large guarding/working dogs can be intimidating to people and terriers can be a real risk to horseriders. I think the majority of shelties are likely to be on the receiving rather than dispensing end of trouble which is why we all feel so strongly about this subject. Discussing this with some large dog owners a year or so ago was very insightful as they often simply didn't realise how intimidating even a friendly approach can be to someone with a small frightened dog. It is very easy for small dogs, especially toy breeds to be injured even if the large dog is benignly trying to play but this aspect was overlooked. I was astonished that we small dog owners are regarded as being over-protective or neurotic and that it is our fault for having poorly socialised dogs if they cannot cope with a dog more than twice their size running directly at them!! It is NOT normal behaviour for dogs to approach others like this so no wonder our small dogs feel intimidated!
Wild canines never rush headlong into a strange animal's space and I wonder if part of the problem is that many dogs don't learn social manners when they are puppies. If they are taken early from the litter and not given the opputunity interact in a CONTROLLED situation while growing up then they don't realise what is unacceptable. Being on a lead does also make a lot of dogs feel trapped and act defensively which possibly provokes more of a reaction from off lead dogs.
Perhaps the answer is better education for owners (vet surgeries, pet shops, training clubs etc) as well as dogs. I think all new owners should attend compulsory training classes that cover behaviour as well as basic commands.
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Just wanted to add that we have impending laws on dog control which will potentially make it an offence for a dog to attack any 'protected' animal including livestock, cats and other dogs.
Sadly we are seeing a increasing problem of Guide Dogs being attacked while working. Horribly this is sometimes a deliberate act of someone setting their fighting dog on the Guide Dog.
I cannot imagine how terrifying it must be for the blind person if this happens, must be ten times worse than a normal dog attack situation. The result is often a traumatised owner who loses confidence to go out and may also lose their 'eyes' as many Guide Dogs are too fearful to continue working. Major trauma to both the dog and human victims and a waste of the money, time and effort that has gone into producing a Guide Dog.
Sadly we are seeing a increasing problem of Guide Dogs being attacked while working. Horribly this is sometimes a deliberate act of someone setting their fighting dog on the Guide Dog.
I cannot imagine how terrifying it must be for the blind person if this happens, must be ten times worse than a normal dog attack situation. The result is often a traumatised owner who loses confidence to go out and may also lose their 'eyes' as many Guide Dogs are too fearful to continue working. Major trauma to both the dog and human victims and a waste of the money, time and effort that has gone into producing a Guide Dog.
BarbV
Forums Celebrity
I created a monster thread!
Yikes. I only thought to pass on a good idea for areas where dogs are walked on and off leash. And a protocol for dealing with dogs that should not be approached but are being trained to be socialized.
I did not expect a debate around whether to walk off or on leash.
Can we go back to whether or not this is a viable idea or not?
Yikes. I only thought to pass on a good idea for areas where dogs are walked on and off leash. And a protocol for dealing with dogs that should not be approached but are being trained to be socialized.
I did not expect a debate around whether to walk off or on leash.
Can we go back to whether or not this is a viable idea or not?
Calliesmom
Moderator
yes- it's a great idea but there has to be education/publicity and cooperation of dog owners. I would love for it to work but in reality- I don't see people knowing/honoring the ribbon.....................
labgirl
Forums Sage
I agree, over here it is deemed responsible to put your dog on lead if you see another dog on lead and most people abide by this. I notice the worst culprits for not doing this are in fact older people, either this is because they don't know they should or because they never have so never will.
If a person does not respond to a dog being on lead, then an added yellow ribbon will make no difference.
However, I can see it having a benefit at dog shows where dogs have to be on lead and it is not always easy to know what they are like with other dogs. Actually, I could see that being good for Merlin when waiting in a queue for agility as it would give people a clear warning he doesn't like being hassled by other dogs.
Seashel is also right about the enforcement of dog orders, for instance in my town we don't even have a dog warden anymore, so who am I to report incidents to? The police don't want to know, the only option is to call Environmental Health and make a report, but they don't have people who can be sent out to enforce things. At the end of the day people will always walk their dogs off lead, some will be responsible, some will not. But that is the same with every aspect of life from the way people park their cars to children being allowed to roam around at all hours of the night and cause trouble.
To clarify one thing, my dogs DO NOT wander willy-nilly up to people when off lead. In fact Merlin ignores everyone, to the point some people get really offended that he walks straight past them without acknowledging them. Cadbury is only off lead when we are alone or with people we know, if I see strangers - dogs or people - then he goes on lead so he can't run up to them. As a big and small dog owner it does trouble me that those with large dogs seem to think it is ok for small dogs to get squashed in play. It is not, but I also always accept an apology when it is offered as I know we are all prone to making mistakes.
